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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:06 am 
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Chuck thanks for your time and Patience doing the alignment on the wagon. \:D/ \:D/ We learned a valuable lesson ;-) .

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:20 am 
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Glad to help Steve. :-$ I won't say anthing about the learned lesson unless you want to ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:23 pm 
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I'll let it out of the bag. =; We had the upper control arms on the wrong side #-o . (they were not marked :-({|= cause they were used.) Chuck said right off they don't look right so we checked the caster and it was 13* O:) So we changed them over and all is well.

Chuck I ordered a new set of front shocks. The old ones are 8 years old. Maybe it will slow the rebound. I talked to TRZ and they said the Aerospace brakes push the wheel out further than stock or Strange. They also said I can add the bump stop and it wouldn't hurt it.

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:34 pm 
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I wouldn't be too embarrassed by that mistake. The reason I knew what was wrong right away was because I've seen it before.

If you're allowed to run double adjustable shocks I think that would help with tuning the suspension a lot. Either way those seemed to be worn out. When you tie it down in the trailer you need to tie it down by the chassis so you're not wearing the shocks out during the trip to and from the track. That goes for front and rear.

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:55 pm 
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Thanks Chuck. we already do tie it down by the frame.

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Steve

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:12 am 
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WR169 wrote:
I'll let it out of the bag. =; We had the upper control arms on the wrong side #-o . (they were not marked :-({|= cause they were used.) Chuck said right off they don't look right so we checked the caster and it was 13* O:) So we changed them over and all is well.

Chuck I ordered a new set of front shocks. The old ones are 8 years old. Maybe it will slow the rebound. I talked to TRZ and they said the Aerospace brakes push the wheel out further than stock or Strange. They also said I can add the bump stop and it wouldn't hurt it.

How did you know they were on the wrong side?
was one tire further in the wheel well than the other?

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:29 pm 
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JEFF69Z28 wrote:
How did you know they were on the wrong side?
was one tire further in the wheel well than the other?


On those cars the upper ball joint should be offset toward the front of the car in relationship to the control arm shaft if they're on right. That and you could see the spindles looked like they were tilted way too far back. It was a little hard to see with the wheel wells in the car and a tubular arm so I just measured the caster. It was over 13* to start with so I knew they were on the wrong sides. Once swapped it dropped the caster to about 6*. When you get the caster that far off it creates a bump steer problem because the steering arm is raised way up. To avoid having to put a bump steer kit on the car I adjusted the caster down to around 4.5*. That nearly eliminated the bump steer.

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:13 am 
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What he said ^^^^^^ =;

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Steve

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:49 am 
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I have a friend that put those tubular As on a Nova and he couldn't drive that thing down track so I'm guessing he made the same mistake. I'll Emal him this week to see if he still has the stuff as he removed it the next week and put the old stuff back on.

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:31 am 
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JEFF69Z28 wrote:
WR169 wrote:
I'll let it out of the bag. =; We had the upper control arms on the wrong side #-o . (they were not marked :-({|= cause they were used.) Chuck said right off they don't look right so we checked the caster and it was 13* O:) So we changed them over and all is well.

Chuck I ordered a new set of front shocks. The old ones are 8 years old. Maybe it will slow the rebound. I talked to TRZ and they said the Aerospace brakes push the wheel out further than stock or Strange. They also said I can add the bump stop and it wouldn't hurt it.

How did you know they were on the wrong side?
was one tire further in the wheel well than the other?

the reason i asked this is because the driver side tire on my car is futher in the wheel well than the passenger side, is this normal or is something wrong?

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JEFF WINTERS
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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:22 pm 
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Ken0069 wrote:
I have a friend that put those tubular As on a Nova and he couldn't drive that thing down track so I'm guessing he made the same mistake. I'll Emal him this week to see if he still has the stuff as he removed it the next week and put the old stuff back on.


Did he have the front aligned after he installed them? Anytime you change a suspension part like that even if you shim it the same the alignment will be off. If the camber/caster changes just a little it will change the toe a lot. That in itself will make one drive like crap. A tire store or regular alignment shop is useless with a modified suspension. You have to find someone that understands suspension not a guy that just does alignments.

JEFF69Z28 wrote:
JEFF69Z28 wrote:
How did you know they were on the wrong side?
was one tire further in the wheel well than the other?

the reason i asked this is because the driver side tire on my car is futher in the wheel well than the passenger side, is this normal or is something wrong?


What do you mean by further in the wheel well? Do you mean front to rear or side to side in relationship to the car?

One other clue to the arms being on the wrong side is the ride height will be higher. This is because as you lean the spindle back it moves it close to the ground. Maybe Steve can post pictures of the ride height before and after the alignment.

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:05 pm 
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Ride height changed a little bit between right and wrong. about 1/2 inch. Chuck I cut the outer edge of the fender well basically between the outer mounting bolts and just before the inner fender mounting bolts. I also put the new shocks on. One was bad. Easy in and out. I taped paper to the tires and painted the inside of the fender well. Then dropped the jack from about wheelie height. No paint on the paper. I then stood on the bumper and jumped up and down O:) had a little bit. I cut it out and redid it and no paint. \:D/ \:D/ \:D/ Call it redneck but it worked ;-) =;

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Steve

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:47 pm 
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Jeff if one wheel is further under the car than the other after switching the arms it would have to be an issue with the length of the arms. Unless the body is on the frame wrong. On Steve's wagon to get the camber to 1/4* I had to shim the LH arm so much there was very little stud left sticking through the shaft. On the right side just enough shims to even up the caster side to side. This moved the top of the wheel inboard but I think the left wheel was still closer to the fender lip than the right. What camber and caster angles (SAI and included angles too if you have them) did you have when you got finished? Are there more shims on one side of the car?

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 Post subject: Re: Changes
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:57 am 
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Gearhead1011 wrote:
On Steve's wagon to get the camber to 1/4* I had to shim the LH arm so much there was very little stud left sticking through the shaft. On the right side just enough shims to even up the caster side to side.


My driver side has many shims on it also and passenger side just a couple.TRZ gave me the specs to set it up and that is how it was done.

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JEFF WINTERS
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BEST TIME TO DATE 9.99 1/4 MILE @132MPH.


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